tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post989158163131064414..comments2024-02-12T08:57:17.556-06:00Comments on 3 Minute Apologetics: Why don't Catholics baptize the way Jesus was baptized (i.e. by full immersion)?The Amateur Apologisthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comBlogger38125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-82971788820451566692017-10-22T11:58:56.047-05:002017-10-22T11:58:56.047-05:00Also, if we read the words in Act, we see, clearly...Also, if we read the words in Act, we see, clearly, that baptism is not to be denied to children: "For the promise is to you and to your children and to all that are far off, every one whom the Lord our God calls to him" (Acts 2:39)The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-75824991203393618262017-10-22T11:40:11.353-05:002017-10-22T11:40:11.353-05:00What does a baby have to repent of, Ken? As an ad...What does a baby have to repent of, Ken? As an adult, repentance is definitely required prior to baptism in the Catholic Church.The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-54666290933399486772017-10-22T10:45:00.088-05:002017-10-22T10:45:00.088-05:00Clearly, a red herring argument.
Ignoring the cle...Clearly, a red herring argument.<br /><br />Ignoring the clear teaching of Christ Himself (catholic men repeat this ignorance in many other important areas)is what leads me to believe that catholicism is not Christian.<br /><br />Forget about what river it was, or who's doing the immersion... God's inerrant Word is clear as a bell about the heart condition that is required prior to Baptism. Repentance, and a conscious desire to turn the care and will of life over to our Savior. catholic baptism, by definition, is errant, and in direct contradiction of God's clear direction on baptism simply because infants are incapable of those two things...Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15474501878258689954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-63864539709829194012016-12-15T22:17:03.287-06:002016-12-15T22:17:03.287-06:00Thanks for your comments, Anonymous.
Regarding yo...Thanks for your comments, Anonymous.<br /><br />Regarding your reference to John 3:1-8 and amniotic fluid--are you saying that Jesus said, essentially, that we "must be born of amniotic fluid and the Spirit"?<br /><br />Would that mean, since everyone is born of amniotic fluid, that everyone is saved?The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-31028203134731023712016-12-15T18:56:22.580-06:002016-12-15T18:56:22.580-06:00John3: 1-8, Jesus explains how salvation is ach...John3: 1-8, Jesus explains how salvation is achieved by being born of water and spirit. <br /><br />So how does birth happen? There's always a transition from the old to the new. <br /><br />In the old testament there are a lot of examples of God's people passing through water (Noah & the flood, Israel & dead sea, Israel entering the promised land, jonah & the whale, etc etc.) <br /><br /><br />The human baby is surrounded by amniotic fluid before birth. In a sense, the child passes through water into the new life (birth). <br /><br /><br /><br />Is it not possible to interpret water baptism to be akin to nature example of birth and old testament example of "passing through water "? Did not God design humans and did not God leads His people in all the examples given? <br /><br /><br />Therefore, in all things seek the leading of the Holy Spirit on what to do with the circumstances you are in. It may be that there is plenty of water then baptising by immersion is easy. Or maybe there isn't any body of water big enough to dip in. Perhaps you have medical problems preventing you from being soaked. <br /><br />I've heard of people in drought regions bring baptised by lying in a shallow grave, wrapped in burial cloth and having water sprinkle on them. <br /><br />In all things seek the leading of the Holy Spirit. He is with us to teach us spiritual things. We will not go wrong of we listen to God's voice and reaffirm that it is of God by referring to the Bible. <br /><br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-43101207409781866182016-04-28T06:39:45.113-05:002016-04-28T06:39:45.113-05:00Amen!
Thanks for your comments, Anonymous.Amen!<br /><br />Thanks for your comments, Anonymous.The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-33182407510383279982016-04-27T23:17:58.104-05:002016-04-27T23:17:58.104-05:00First off, 2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is inspire...First off, 2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is inspired by God...<br />This shows the Old Testament is a foreshadowing of the New Testament. <br />Ezekiel 36:25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean....Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-1582601115356682072013-06-15T14:07:52.172-05:002013-06-15T14:07:52.172-05:00Haha! I enjoyed your pun. :)
I understand what y...Haha! I enjoyed your pun. :)<br /><br />I understand what you are trying to say, Engine 1, but the point remains: what criteria do you use to determine that you are baptizing the way Jesus was baptized? Why do you rather arbitrarily choose the criterion "He was baptized by immersion" and not 'He was baptized by his cousin"?<br /><br />I don't understand that. <br /><br />If I wanted my children to "get married the way I was", and I was married by my cousin, a priest, wouldn't they assume that I mean, "Get married by your cousin" is the criterion I am using?The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-91875742477462549672013-06-15T13:55:10.477-05:002013-06-15T13:55:10.477-05:00I am sorry but your argument does not hold......&q...I am sorry but your argument does not hold......"WATER" (hahahehe) if my dad fished with an open face reel an used worms for bait in a lake and caught blue gills and, and I go to a river and fish with an open face reel and use worms for bait and catch perch. Then I am still fishing the way my father fished. Even though we are not the same age and we fished in different places. Or if my uncle taught me how to paint with a roller using horizontal strokes rather than vertical an painted interior walls in a house in a state in the USA with blue acrylic paint, and I use a roller and and paint with horizontal strokes in stead of vertical and I paint exterior walls on a barn in a province in Canada with red oil based paint then even though we use different paints and he paints inside and I paint outside we are not the same age, he is painting a house, I am painting barn, One is in a state while the other is in a province, and they are in completely different different countries I am still painting the same way my uncle painted. Engine 1https://www.blogger.com/profile/04007112258628877916noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-45672517098888039012012-03-02T17:49:44.811-06:002012-03-02T17:49:44.811-06:00I suppose every priest and liturgical committee ha...I suppose every priest and liturgical committee has their own idea's of pressing the envelope to the extreme on symbolism or at least their own fancied idea of Baptismal symbolism.<br /><br />Not trying to be disrespectful but I find the bathing suits, etc used in Full Immersion Baptisms is far too much of a show display, whether the Adult RCIA candidates are wearing a gown or not. Sadly; IMHO the Spiritual Aspect of Baptism gets lost and pushed aside to a lesser importance in place of the spectacle of full immersion that often brings giggles in the congregation. And really does Full Immersion give a greater Spiritual Significance compared to those Catholics who choose the Trice Baptismal Infusion method? Arguably; some poorly Catechized Catholics might think so.<br /><br />For many hundreds of years in the Catholic Church Baptismal Infusion has been the preferred choice for both infants and RCIA candidates.<br /><br />I mean really are officials in the Church trying to replace the Baptismal Font for the River Jordon? Sadly that would seem apparent in some parishes.<br /><br />Thankfully; my parish doesn't do Full Immersion but maintains Baptism by Infusion without all the extra fanfare. RCIA candidates being Baptized in my parish on Easter Vigil don't wear white gowns either, they wear their Best Sunday Dress and to symbolize their new baptism they naturally get a lit baptismal candle and wear a White Baptismal Stole.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-24204700987570662152012-02-22T19:48:57.333-06:002012-02-22T19:48:57.333-06:00Regarding this comment: "The prayers of Gods...Regarding this comment: "The prayers of Gods people are like insence, that smell sweeter then anything known to us. A Harp that makes the sweetest sound to his ears, that can not compare to any other. And presented to the Lamb in golden bowls, for he wants nothing more then our prayers,love,and fellowship."<br /><br />I give a hearty "amen!" to that, as ought all Catholics!<br /><br />As for your comment here:<br />"Now i will break it down the way that you saw it. "which are the prayers of the saints." You believe that the prayers are the "collected prayers" to the saints, and presented to the Lamb. but you are wrong my brother."<br /><br />it would have been helpful if you could have explained how it is that I am wrong. Simply saying so does not make it so, unfortunately. <br /><br />Perhaps if you had an argument to offer as to why I am wrong--that these saints in heaven holding golden bowls of our prayers can't know what these prayers are??? <br /><br />then I could offer a response.<br /><br />Alas.The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-36903556292880365792012-02-22T19:43:50.803-06:002012-02-22T19:43:50.803-06:00I am sorry to see you leave so soon after we were ...I am sorry to see you leave so soon after we were just getting to the meat and potatoes of your objections to praying to the saints, Anonymous.<br /><br />As far as your being raised a Catholic, sadly, that does not give any indication as to your knowledge of the faith. Most people who were raised Catholic cannot even answer a simple Catholic question: "where is Scripture said at Mass?" The only thing they might say is, "Um?? When we say the Our Father? Or when the Gospel is read?"*<br /><br />Most likely your poor knowledge of your Catholic faith is not your fault. The Church, in the past, did an abysmal job providing nourishing catechesis for her flock.<br /><br />Thankfully, that is changing.<br /><br />*Note: here's the answer to "where is Scripture said in the Mass": EVERYWHERE. Practically every word uttered by the priest and the laity comes straight from the words of Scripture. If you remember from your Catholic days we often proclaim, "Thanks be to God!" as our response. <br /><br />See 2 Corinthians 9:15 to see where that comes from.<br /><br />You may also remember the priest praying, "I leave you peace, my peace I give to you."<br /><br />See what the Scriptures say in John 14:27.<br /><br />And on and on it goes.<br /><br />IOW: if one is familiar with the Bible, when he goes to Mass he will be familiar with all the prayers.The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-17064312297190321142012-02-21T18:38:31.986-06:002012-02-21T18:38:31.986-06:00Regarding your comment that Mary and the saints ca...Regarding your comment that Mary and the saints cannot heal. Well, in one sense, that's true. God alone heals.<br /><br />But he also gives his saints the power to heal through their own hands. That's from Scripture, too!<br /><br />So Mary can heal, just like St. Paul healed (Acts 19:11). And St. Peter (Acts 5:15).The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-5687601262343027972012-02-21T18:25:49.532-06:002012-02-21T18:25:49.532-06:00As far as praying to the saints: yes, of course w...As far as praying to the saints: yes, of course we have a great audience in heaven--God.<br /><br />But if you can understand prayer chains--surely your church has one, yes? <br /><br />Then you can understanding calling on Mary and the other Saints to add us to their prayer chain. For the prayers of a righteous man avails us much, right?<br /><br />And who is more righteous than those in heaven?<br /><br />And, as we've already established from Rev. 5:8 we know those in heaven hear our prayers.<br /><br />And we've already seen that you cannot provide a verse that says those in heaven can NOT hear our prayers. <br /><br />It would appear quite clear that those in heaven are simply part of the prayer chain--just like your church has (or ought to!)The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-10292904243809741192012-02-21T18:14:04.123-06:002012-02-21T18:14:04.123-06:00Here's the man-made tradition you are followin...Here's the man-made tradition you are following: "Everything I believe (about God) is found in the Bible".<br /><br />It's a man-made tradition because it's not based on anything you ever read in the Bible.<br /><br />It's based on what you heard a man say, who heard another man say, who heard another man say, but no one ever read "Everything I believe is found in the Bible" in a single page of Scripture.<br /><br />That makes it a man-made tradition you're following.The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-68552423331634391612012-02-21T18:08:55.733-06:002012-02-21T18:08:55.733-06:00now this will be my last response to you. and it&#...now this will be my last response to you. and it's about the verse that you gave to explain why you pray to whoever besides God.yes i know that you too pray to God. I know your tradition quite well. I used be a Catholic, full pledged and proud.Until i READ the Bible. But i can only speak of how i understood the verse presented by you.----The prayers of Gods people are like insence, that smell sweeter then anything known to us. A Harp that makes the sweetest sound to his ears, that can not compare to any other. And presented to the Lamb in golden bowls, for he wants nothing more then our prayers,love,and fellowship.<br />Now i will break it down the way that you saw it. "which are the prayers of the saints." You believe that the prayers are the "collected prayers" to the saints, and presented to the Lamb. but you are wrong my brother. In turn you say that they can hear our prayers, but all the scriptures with out a doubt say that God can hear them. any other scriptures could possible say that some one else can hear your prayers, i soppose in the dark.<br />this is my last comment to you, i ask that you post all of these that i have sent you so that you may relook over them. May the grace of the Lord Jesus be with you. GoodbyeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-33992972800802376332012-02-21T17:59:32.257-06:002012-02-21T17:59:32.257-06:00You do indeed take someone's word for the Word...You do indeed take someone's word for the Word, Anonymous.<br /><br />Each and every time you quote Scripture you are giving tacit acknowledgement to the authority of the Catholic Church to discern for you what was Scripture and what was not.<br /><br />You know that the Gospel of Mark is inspired because the Catholic Church discerned for you that it was. You know that the Gospel of Thomas is NOT inspired because the Catholic Church discerned for you that it wasn't.<br /><br />There is no other way for you to know what's God's Word, except through the Church.<br /><br />Unless you can tell me how it is that you know that, say, Hebrews is inspired and that the Shepherd of Hermas is not?The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-37237512490534701392012-02-21T17:31:48.354-06:002012-02-21T17:31:48.354-06:00now with that said i would like you to explain, if...now with that said i would like you to explain, if you will,how exactly i am following a man-made tradition? as you have notice i never said that i speak for all Bible Christians, where you have claimed to speak for all Catholics. So how does it feel to know the oppinions of every Catholic? but let me ask you this, if you believe something that is not in the Bible, then is it for God? I do not like assumption made of the Bible it could easily lead someone astray, may the Lord have pity on the one who leads Gods sheep astray. Just so you know the versus about the prayers was to show you that, you already have a great audiance in heaven, from God. Who else do you need? I just cant grasp this. mary or the saints can not hear nor heal the prayers, of men. the bible says that one man sharpens another.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-2390844533960677592012-02-21T17:15:27.845-06:002012-02-21T17:15:27.845-06:00haha...Well it's like i said, quite plainly, T...haha...Well it's like i said, quite plainly, That i do not take anyones word for the Word,not even the church's priest. Now lets make something clear. By no means do I say, that i do not attend a church, that is not true. The Bible tells us that we need each other to grow in God through a church.Proverbs 27:17,- "As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-92188320007940155772012-02-20T20:19:36.128-06:002012-02-20T20:19:36.128-06:00Catholics respond with a hearty "amen!" ...Catholics respond with a hearty "amen!" to that!<br /><br />And I'm glad that you acknowledge that you can't find any verses in Scripture that say those in heaven cannot hear us.<br /><br />Rather, I offer you this:<br /><br />Revelations 5:8:And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of God’s people. <br /><br />Clearly, those in heaven heard "the prayers of God's people."The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-33215138253983372732012-02-20T20:11:24.264-06:002012-02-20T20:11:24.264-06:00I haven't read any versus that say those in he...I haven't read any versus that say those in heaven can not hear us. quite the opposete i have 4 versus that state prayers can be heard from heaven.<br />Rom 8:34,"It is Christ Jesus,who died,yes,who was raised,who is at the right hand of God,who indeed intercedes for us."<br />Rom 8:27,"And God, who searches the heart,knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God."<br />Heb 7.25,"Therefore He is able to save completly those who come to God through him, because He always lives to intercede for them."<br />1 Tim 2:5,"For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the Christ Jesus."<br />These are all great examples that ,God in all, can hear our prayers from Heaven, who else do we need when we have a front row step to His throne.<br />Heb 4:16,"Let us approach the the throne of grace with boldness,so that we may recieve mercy and find grace to help in time of need."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-32979456666239554122012-02-20T20:09:03.288-06:002012-02-20T20:09:03.288-06:00That's fine, Anonymous.
Except that, since th...That's fine, Anonymous.<br /><br />Except that, since this belief is not commanded in Scripture, you are following a man-made tradition.<br /><br />You heard somebody say, "Everything I believe is found in the Bible" and believed him or her, but neither of you ever read that in the pages of the Bible.<br /><br />It's simply following a man-made tradition.<br /><br />That is, unless you can come up with a verse that says, "Everything Christians believe must be found in the Scriptures."<br /><br />While it's true that "all Scripture is inspired by God", as 2 Tim 3:16 says, that means that everything you read in Scripture is God-breathed....HOWEVER, that's not the same thing as saying, "Everything I believe must be found in the pages of Scripture.<br /><br />There is no verse that says that.<br /><br />And, as such, it is a man-made traditionThe Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-37150846724022688782012-02-20T19:45:00.109-06:002012-02-20T19:45:00.109-06:00everything that i believe is found in the Bible,my...everything that i believe is found in the Bible,my friend. I do not let someone tell me the Word, without giving scriptures. I will not put my soul in the hands of men so easily.(1 corinthians 2:5)-",so that your faith might rest not on human wisdom but on the power of God.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-64051999829100131212012-02-19T16:07:36.405-06:002012-02-19T16:07:36.405-06:00Regarding the verse in 2 Chronicles, Catholics giv...Regarding the verse in 2 Chronicles, Catholics give a hearty "amen!" to that!<br /><br />I am still looking for a verse that says that those in heaven can't hear our prayers.<br /><br />And again, by praying to others, all we're doing is asking them to pray for us.<br /><br />We do not worship anyone except the Triune God.The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8319525241110721507.post-63629200678642674712012-02-19T16:03:17.859-06:002012-02-19T16:03:17.859-06:00You pray that I can prove everything we believe in...You pray that I can prove everything we believe in the pages of the Bible? <br /><br />Why are you holding me to a standard that you cannot keep, Anonymous?<br /><br />Your own belief: "Everything we believe needs to be found in the Bible" cannot be found in the Bible.The Amateur Apologisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06042589564126217004noreply@blogger.com